UAD4: Colors on the Web: Few Things, Great Results

[Intro Music]

Announcer: You are listening to one in a series of presentations from the 2008 HighEdWeb Conference in Springfield, Missouri.

Martha Gabriel: So, good afternoon. My name is Martha Gabriel. I'm from Brazil. It's a great pleasure for me to be here. This is my ninth year in WebDev. Last year I wasn't able to come, but I presented on Second Life. So, I really love this conference. 

And I'm going to talk about my background. This is very important because I engineer and then I took post relations in Marketing and Design and then my Master's degree is in Art. And I am taking my PhD in Art. So I'm talking about colors because I think it's really important. I have talked in this conference other times about YXML, search engine optimization, but colors, this is my favorite presentation. So I hope you'll enjoy.

I'm a professor in Brazil. I teach in the MBA school and also in digital design and game design. I teach interface. And also I am an artist. I do artworks with technology.

So the subject today is Color on the Web. We are going to cover these aspects: Color on the Web--the characteristics of each one, psychodynamics and harmony. Some guidelines for you so you can have some rules that help you when you are designing. 3D, then you're going to use the glasses. And the finishing, some conclusions and some reference for you.

I'm sorry. I apologize for my accent. I know I have it. I have studied English all my life. It wasn't enough. So if you don't understand something, I can rephrase, repeat, write anything you need me to do, OK? So let's go.

The important thing about interface and color--a few years ago we used to say that we could do anything on the Web. We know that is not true. Choice rules the Web. People stay five to 10 seconds in your website inside if they stay or they go away, what they do.

So, why are colors so important? Eighty percent of our perception are due to visual. Vision. Only 20% are given to hearing and other things. 

How many of you have had ideas when you are taking a bath? Why do you think that it happens? Because the vision is controlled. You cannot see anything. You are inside the box. And what happens is the other senses start to pop up, like the warmth of the water, the sense of touching, and the smell of the soap. And then you start thinking in different way. And then you release your prism of vision. 

But when you are on the Web, you are not on the bath. So we need to pay attention on the visuals. And color and form are the two elements of visual communication. Forms are related to the intellect and color are related with emotions, with feelings.

If I show you this Web page, this is Yahoo! some years ago. And this is colored as it is nowadays. But in 2002, one year after September 11, they put on black and with this kind of gray. It is for expressed feelings. And we have all these feelings all year and the same date, etcetera. So it's about feelings.

There is another interesting example. Have you seen this movie, "Pleasantville"? This is very interesting. It seems that life is perfect in black and white, but it's not perfect. When you start to have feelings, things are changing to color. And the good things happen, the bad things happen, but this is about life. So this is about emotions. So those of you that didn't see this movie, I really recommend you.

Color is information itself. So I'm going to show you this and look the words and the colors and say loud the color, not the words. All right? Can you say?

This is hard. I know. There is a conflict. Several conflicts. The right side of your brain try to say the color, but the left side wants to read the word. And then you get the conflict. It happens in ad website, in every advertisement, in everything with us. So if you don't pay attention on colors than how it's connected with information, it can cause conflict instead of engage people, and this is our point here. This is the important thing.

So color and brain. The human brain ejects under-simulation and also over-simulation. Color is essential for harmony. The sense of order. Order is not symmetry, OK? Sometimes symmetry seems to be boring, seems to be not in order. Sometimes you need to do some multiplications to have this sense. So color is a powerful communication. To Van Gogh it was the color that conveys and expresses the meaning of the image, not the forms that it have.

And as much as in stores and the houses, we have bricks, color at the elements that build this wall of visual communication and plays a fundamental role in the consumer critical decision. To buy, not to buy. Engage, not engage. Stay or not stay in your website.

We don't think about colors. We feel them. I'm going to show you some examples that are color and then black and white. So, please try to feel what changes inside you when you are in one situation and the other one. So this is one. 

This is Brazilian school. Samba. You can see how many colors.

Some are from nature, some are artificial, like fireworks or things like that. But it doesn't matter where. We feel differently when we see colors. So the way we feel, the way we act. Usually we act differently when we feel differently. 

So the goal here, Colors on Web, the goal here is to try to make people feeling the right way, at least for us, the way we want it to see. And what I said about color is right for every media. What does the Web has to do with this? It's different.

The website is different from any other pre-existing media. It has no beginning or end. It's a space. In a space, you have interaction. And in interactivity, navigation is critical. And the color plays a fundamental role on that. Layout and navigation are very important.

A website is an unstable media. All of you know that, actually. The keynote was really interesting because it comes just first before my presentation. And the point is you are responsible for your communications, for your design. And here, we are trying to do the same. To be responsible for our communication, to convey what we want to convey.

In Web we cannot control things. We cannot control all the colors. We still have the problem with Web-Safe--everybody knows about the Web-Safe Dilemma? Those who don't know can talk to me later on. We don't have time to go through it. But it's too important for those who develop for cell phones or PGA that has small amount of color that... So maybe we can talk about that. 

So how color creates a logical engaging visual, in fact it's essential for designing in a flexible environment. Phil Kotler, which is the guru in marketing, he's the Father of Marketing, has analyzed that E-commerce and the interfaces. And he says that one of the seven most important problems in E-commerce is the interface. 

You can have old stuff running perfectly. All the performance doing OK, but if you don't have a very cool and interesting interface for that target public, they will not stay there. So what matters if you have the best engine behind that, if you have the best engineering behind that, these people are not going to stay there. So the first thing that engages people are the interface.

And the colors can work either against or for your design. For example, yellow is really good for resorts. We think warm and sunny, etcetera. But it can destroy a law firm because yellow is connected to cowardice. So you cannot use--can you remember any law firm that have it yellow as color? Usually they have blue or green or something like that.

So the challenge is, in this unstable media that is the Web, why design a website? We must obtain a harmonic color scheme to attract and keep the users in the website, and to be able to deliver the emotional feelings that we want them to have so they can be for our works.

And then we play with two things: color harmony to deliver balance, and color psychodynamic to deliver feelings.

So whoever produces Web design, us, I think all of us here do that, we need to think about the colors to obtain the specific feelings that convey the specific reactions that we want. 

I have a quotation from Dostoyevsky that goes perfectly with the keynote speaker. "If people around you doesn't listen to you, fall on your knees before them and ask for forgiveness, because in reality this is your fault." I hope I don't have to fall on my knees in the end of the presentation, but you are the only responsible for your communication, so you are the one. 

When I teach interface design, and I always say to my students, we usually say that the user is dummy. They are stupid. They don't know what--we are stupid, we don't know what they need. We need to attract them. They can choose other websites to go, so it's not their problem.

So, color psychodynamics. As much as music and forms, color has psychological aspects. There is a test you can take this later on. This presentation is in the--if you have the handouts, I put everything in one page so you have a very quick reference with all the information I have here. And this presentation is online. The URL is in the handout. And you can take this personality test. It's really simple. You choose some colors and then the test says some things about you. And this is impressive. It says a lot of really, really true things. And every person I asked to do this, it gets to be true. I don't know how and why, but it happens. I invite you to do that.

About color meanings. We are going to talk about psychodynamics and it's about meaning. Each thought depend on the context. You cannot be out of the context when you think about meanings of colors.

So cultural and geographical perception. Eskimos can see hundreds of shades of white, we cannot. If we are in the desert, people that live in desert can see several shades of cream and sand tones. We cannot. And cultural and geographical perception, how they combine with other colors. For instance, black can be very sad, very sorrow. But if you put some yellow or gold with black to get to be sophisticated, the amount of color you put, more black or more yellow, it changed completely the meaning of the colors. 

Fashion, it's different. viewer's age. Color is different for old people and for young people. And I always ask people is it possible to have a favorite color. Do you have a favorite color? Without contest. I love black. I don't have any wall in black of my house. Black is good for cloth, maybe for a car, so you cannot--every time people ask me, "What is your favorite color?" I always answer, "Depends." Depends on for what.

And this is the same here. What is the perfect color for what we are doing? Depends. Mostly, target the audience. So there are some color meanings that are felt in the same way, 80% in the western cultures. 

If we go to eastern, we need to pay attention because some things are exactly the opposite. White is for dying when we are burying people. And red is for celebrating. So this is different. We are going to talk about now of the psychodynamics for western cultures, OK? 

So let's see some colors. First, if you follow this psychodynamics and then you follow the few rules of harmony, you can design any website.

First, when I was only engineer, I had a lot of troubles to see how colors could be combined properly. You can get the pallets from the nature if you want, but it's not that easy. You need to know how to combine. But if you get from here, you are going to make no mistake and you are going to get good designs. 

So primary colors. Red, color of proximity, encounters, war, some fire, tension, woman, conquest, seduction, courage, patience, power, energy, etcetera. Blue, color of movement, to the infinite, cold, sea, sky, horizon, humility, spacing, etcetera. And yellow, color of the sun, big flowers, summer, lemon, envy, selfishness, cowardice. We have talked about that before. And you just see some examples. 

Do you remember red is for proximity, encounters? So Coca-Cola has based on primary colors in red and also McDonald's with primary colors were combining them.

Other--the secondary colors, that's formed by mixing the primary colors. We have orange: fire, blazing, autumn, dawn, party, power, brightness and patient. Green: equilibrium. Do you know the spectrum from blue to red? Green is the middle. And when you think about the meaning of green, it's equilibrium. It's kind of interesting. Physically, it's in the middle, and the sensation it passed to us is that we are in balance when we are in green. So the physical things of color are very connected to the way emotions are conveyed to us. So, equilibrium, peace, unleashed passion, humidity, freshness, forest and etcetera. 

And the purple is the color of mystery, and night, dawn, dream, church. Did you know that the purple color is the color for karma? When you use purple, you are calling your karma. If you've seen Catholic church, the fathers, when you have a very solemn ceremony, they use the purple colors. So this is a scent of purple, all the what is meant to be, or something like that.

Some examples with secondary colors. We are using this ring and with some kind of purple together. 

Tertiary colors, we have mix. They are the earth colors. They send us to earth, mood, autumn, illness. We have several tertiary colors like earth colors, OK? I'm showing just some of them. And here is an example of a website with tertiary colors. 

You can feel that each website is different and convey different feelings according to the colors they have. Of course you have already the colors of your university. At least you have a logo. 

And the challenge here is how can you see your colors and convey the things that they must convey. So I hope you can find the harmony in the next thing we are going to show now.

So we know the colors and the meanings. And now we need to mix them. So, the meanings change our perception. And the harmony makes us feel comfortable with design and wanting to be there. 

The first kind of harmony is triads. You just pick the color wheel, and then you pick three colors in a triangle. You can pick any of these colors. Primary, secondary or tertiary. If you pick the three primary colors, you have the maximum contrast. If you want a more subdued contrast, medium, you pick the secondary colors. If you want a more subtle contrast, then you pick the tertiary colors. 

And you can switch these. I'm going to give you several tools where you can do this easily online, and then you can switch and combine the colors.

The example with primary colors in the triads combination is the McDonald's. The three primary colors: red, yellow and blue. 

Then, analogous. This is when you pick three colors in sequence in the wheel. And then you can choose which one because they are near each other. They go along with each other very easily. And they keep in this area. We are going to talk about cold and warm colors. This kind we are the warmest colors. So this case, again, Coca-Cola. It gets the red and then the variations of orange. And then we get very good harmonic colors. 

Complementary. When we want the most dramatic effect in color harmony, you get the opposite color in the wheel. This is your complementary color.

When you mix complementary color, they get gray. The gray is the color that is the unrelation of the both. So they have the maximum contrast. 

So when you find the complementary color, you can have dramatic combinations of dramatic effect. For example, in this one, we have, yes... OK. Here we have yellow with purple. And here we have orange with blue. Orange and blue go along and we have a lot of websites on the Web that's combined blue and orange. 

And then hot-cold. We can separate the wheel in the hot and cold areas. And we have some colors that sometimes they act as hot, sometimes they act as cold, depending on which colors are together.

In this case, we can pick one color from the hot side and one color from the cold side. And we can have a very interesting contrast. Like this red and blue. You have a contrast and you can see... You can draw attention for specific points of your design. 

And then, quality color. Quality color, we have dark and light shadings. You can choose any colors combining that. And then you pick one color as a highlight. In this example, we have the gray, and black and white in gray as the shades, and then you see the orange very... This is for specific design when you want people to see first the thing you are putting there. Like here, the first thing you see is the car. So you want to draw attention to the car. So there.

There is a Color IQ test. I'm not going to do this. We don't have time. But you can test later on. You have some colors in beginning and the end. You need to fill between with the specific shades, and then it says if you are good or not on... I'm not going to do it in public. So I'm not going to test me, OK? And I need to say that some of these examples in website I have the help of my friend, Elena Sergili, so these are the credits to selected websites. It's hard work. 

Then, the guidelines. How can we do? We have the psychodynamics, we have the harmony, and then how do we start? So, know your target audience. I work with marketing, and the first thing we do is know who you are talking to. It is everything in life. It's the same here. It's most important thing. 

Age, culture, geographic position, status, everything. If people like more Macintosh than Windows, it can make a difference. So you need to pay attention and know that. 

The more specific your audience is, the more control you have. If I know everybody that I design to are gamers. I know what they use and specific things, or if it's inside my university and I know how the lab is configured, OK, I can do something in more control. But the broader the audience is, the more standard and common sense we need to use so we can get everybody.

The second thing is, use few colors. It's much more important to know how to combine them than have a lot of colors. So amateurs using a lot of colors and then professionals usually use less. More is less, less is more. Use restraint.

Third, establish your harmonious color coordination. This is the first thing we need to do after we know the audience and we have few colors. Which colors are you going to use in every fashion, and how they are combined to each other. So, cool and warm colors works the best. 

Four, when in doubt, throw out half of your graphics. Do you remember when we say use two colors? So it's the same with the graphics. Keep your colors, font styles, sizes to a minimum. Picasso used to say, "A good painting is a result of a series of destructions." So we are going to destruct and then things start to be OK. It combines with web 2.0. 

And also, Saint-Exupery: "Perfection is achieved not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away." So when you have everything done, take something--Coco Chanel used to say, "If you go out, stop in front of the mirror and take something out." Always there is something that is too much. This is the same.

I have a great tool here, VisiBone. I had used this tool for years. I'm going to give you more URLs of other tools, but VisiBone I'm going to show you quickly.

Oh, I don't have the access. Sorry. I need to enter the logging in. You can check. This is great. You just go there and they have all the colors. And as we started to pick the colors, it shows the code, the hex code, and each one next to the other. So you can see first, and then using in your design, it's a great tool. There are several others but this one is the simpler and one of the best tools I have used so far.

Don't forget about the content. This is very important. When we develop the design, we usually are not seeing the content. We're having no, no, no, no, no. We have some examples of pictures, but when the contents come in, it changes everything because they have colors or not. So the typist's dynamic harmonies will strongly contrast with text. 

So if you have text, your website's about articles and information and tutorial, you can use more strong colors, more than any harmonies. But if you are E-commerce site, for example, you don't know which colors are coming with the figures, with the merchandise that is appearing on the page. So you use subtle harmonies. It's more sophisticated and you can have anything on the page and it's not going to harm your design. 

Colors on the screen are RGB and the print colors are CMYK. 

One of my clients in Brazil--I have a small company in Brazil. I teach and also I had a company before I started teaching actually. One of our clients is HBO, HBO Warner Television Brazil, entertainment television. And they have a lot of information in high definition. They need to give to other press releases to be printed, so what do you do? 

You have the information beautiful in RGB, and also have the CMYK prepared files so they can download and they can print this properly. So you need to think about your audience and the objective of your Web page. So this is one thing we can't... 

Now you can put on the glasses. This is a great technique we can use in printing and you can use on Web.

I ask you, if you are interested in this technique, there is a software I'm going to show you quickly. In my website you can download and play with this, so you can take the glass home. If you're not going to use the glass, so return so I can use in other presentations. But if you are going to try at home, please keep it and take with you. You can play later on.

This technology with these glasses, you can see the imagery. It's beautiful with or without the glasses. You cannot see the 3D without the glasses, but it still is not like red and green when you cannot see the image. What happens is these glasses, they could defy color in depth. And the blue is the far most color, red is the more close to you, and green is the middle, again. So we can develop drawings and images in hiding that in the color.

I gave you the information here. You can check from a tech website if you want. And then I'm going to show you some examples. So these are some classical examples. You can see I can go this, so...

There are some from Dallas from Colin Shouris. He's a friend of mine. 

You see when you use red and blue, it gets the most dramatic depth. Usually the best combination is background in black and RGB in the colors over.

This world map is really interesting. San Diego Super Computer Center, they have developed--they have websites, I gave you the link. They have maps from almost everywhere. You can see the maps. This is like visualization we were seeing just a few minutes ago. And then we can use this in VRML as well. So you can go there, more blue, more yellow. You can... Something like this... So you can play as much as you want.

And I have developed a software--let me show you very quickly. It's online, only it's not here. 3D maybe. Oh, here. Let me just... You can try yourself to develop some things and change this and see how it does.

So you can try. It's online, you can... We have developed just for people to--and you can turn on and turn off rainbow and splash and this kind of things. So, just for fun.

And so, just for finishing, I have separated some resource for you. Color theory, these two websites are great. They have all the theory you want to know. If you don't want to know theory but you want to go specifically hands-on on the work, this site, "Color in Motion", Maria Claudia Cortes, is really great. It has all the dolls--not the dolls. That is the personage in each color, and each personage reacts according to the colors. 

Color harmony, we have calculator, ColorMagic, ColorSchemer, VisiBone, the one I told you that is really terrific. And also in my personal website, I usually add more links as I find great tools if you check over there. Martha.com.br in the session and links I'm always putting things on search engine optimizations, wise XML and colors. It's there.

And if you know anything better, forgive my innocence. If not, enjoy with me. The quotation from Wallace. Thank you very much and then we open for questions now.

[Applause]

Audience 1: What is that on a background...

Martha Gabriel: I cannot hear you...

Audience 1: Can you recommend any combinations for reading text that's in color on a background? There are too many fonts that not all other sites, not all of our backgrounds use an off-white as the background for most of our sites, but not all are using those. And I, I mean I've been using at times text in a color on a background that's in a certain color, and I wonder if you have any suggestions for readability?

Martha Gabriel: Yes. I cannot suggest you the colors, but I can suggest you the technique, because it depends on the color. You need to have contrast for reading. And in this point the complementary colors are good because you can see one against each other. And sometimes you can have some kind of impression in that if you want the best thing to do is to test how it works one over the other.

It depends on the face of the font. If the face is large or really... So the only way to do this is to test. If you want to show me later on which color you have, sometimes we have restrictions. We have a color that is imposed to us, and we need to try to get the best for this. If you want me to see, I need to see colors and then we can... I'll be glad to talk to you and help you with the schemes.

Audience 2: Would you say that in general you wouldn't want to use, like, pure complementary primary colors or/and secondary? Like red and green to get that vibration or--

Martha Gabriel: Yeah. If you want the very best. Yeah.

Audience 2: So maybe not primary?

Martha Gabriel: Yeah. Maybe primary not, but maybe the others. Or maybe you wanted this kind of effect or... This is why if you have a lot of text, just maybe you don't need that. But if you don't, sometimes you want.

So it depends on--if you want to have 3D, that you need to think in another different way. So if you want to show me I'd be glad to work with you. No problem at all. Yes.

Audience 3: You have very simple colors and certain tones were used...?

Martha Gabriel: Oh, yes. On the screen, the scheme for seeing colors, RGB. When you print colors, they are CMYK. Cyan, Magenta, Yellow and Black. And you separate these layers. This is how it goes to print. And they print first one color, then the other they overlay. 

So if you send to the people who are going to print your logo or some image, in RGB, the colors that come out are completely doomed. They are not what you want them to be. So this is really easy. If you go to Photoshop, you just need to change the color mode and then you save this separately. And then you don't let to the chance, to the user to do that. So if they forgot your logo, you do it yourself, your logo is always OK. Logo.

Yeah. But you have difference in colors. If you are working with print materials and you really, really want to have the fidelity, if you work with art or very sophisticated design, you cannot have these variations. And they are really great--not great, big. They are really big, and they affect your sign. 

Sometimes when you have printing information on the Web, you just have tutorials or think that people, OK, but if you have a tutorial on colors, you should pay attention because if the people print it and it's not the same, they are going to follow the broader rules. OK? More questions?

Audience 5: I was wondering, what colors can match. Do you have research on this we can get?

Martha Gabriel: Yeah. You're right.

Audience 5: --a lot of research on--

Martha Gabriel: Yeah. There is a paper, yes. I can send you a paper. Actually, I'm author of a book in search engine optimization. I have just launched in Brazil. If Google were black instead of being white, we'd have a lot of energy-saving. This is because a lot of people go to Google. If you think about my Web page, it doesn't matter. This is a few people that go there everyday. 

But if you go several--the other thing is what you say is true because black is less than white, and then also if you--I don't know if you know that, but Google has data centers near the power generators. They consume a lot of energy, and every time, sometimes people say, "Don't print, send a mail." But when you send in mail, it's like to turn on the lantern.

Sometimes I don't know if it's better or if it's worse. Depends on how many servers you are going to pass through when you send in mail. So this is true. If you are planning to save energy or think about environment, if you are developing your website that's going to be very, very accessible for too many people, we should use dark colors. That consume less energy than--OK.

Audience 6: With readability, too, because there's the--you know, is it white text on a black screen or...?

Martha Gabriel: Black on white. Opposite. The understood is that black on white is the best way for reading. The researchers show that the book readers, they are always trying to imitate the paper, which is black over white.

But we can be creative and sometimes do the opposite. Actually, we don't read on screen too much. We print when we--or we can as in your--download and see on our own computer. So maybe we can mix both things according to these, but you're right. Black on white is the most readable.

Audience 7: I have one of my websites, the primary audiences are high school students and their parents.

Martha Gabriel: OK.

Audience 7: And some of the ages are... There's a lot of information and I recently had an idea: well, what if we made sections where, you know, this is information for parents and we gave that a subtle background. And I'm wondering if that's a good idea or if it would be better just to have two pages or...?

Martha Gabriel: Or maybe you could have--I don't know if you have logging and do you know if it's a parent or if it's a student, because you can change the CSS. You can have some information and change the colors and how the page is shown depends on the audience. 

The problem is when you don't know who is there, because you don't have-- and then maybe it's good to be separated. They are completely different. Parents. We had seen a lot of good presentations here talking about this. My kids are 20, 19 years old. I have seen them working. They are multi-task. They use only social network. They are very, very quick on things. They are different from the parents. And we are exception because we are techs, we are geeks.

And the parents usually are slow. They need glasses, they have a lot of spaces that kids don't. So if you don't engage the parents--in our university, we had sessions for parents when we had the missions and then they go there and the completely different talk from when the students are coming to prospective university. 

So I think this is a good idea, to have different spaces. Otherwise you are not going to engage the parents or give the information for them.

Actually I think they enter in different spaces, anyway. But we can't publish them.

More questions? We still have five minutes.

Audience 8: Around 30 years ago, they went with a blue background, you know, blue screen for most of the time. Is that because it's easier on the eye? Is that not true?

Martha Gabriel: Oh, I don't think so. I think... for most of people, history for me is memory. I start with the cards and then the green, and then the white and then I think it was easier. When you had more colors to put on the websites or any system, you choose these systems in, for example, administrative systems use the blue. A lot of them. I think this is the easier option from the system but I don't think someone has thought about these when they developed. They just had this.

It's like the green. That green was terrible. And we used to spend hours and hours in front of that. Nobody thought about that. And I had one that was orange. Even worse. But anyway, we used to do that. 

Now I think we are thinking about colors because we have option. It's very easy. In the beginning of the Web, we had the dilemma, the Safe Color dilemmas. I don't know how many of you have seen the same colors in Macintosh and PC completely different. You couldn't read in one and the other. So we had 216 colors only to do all the job. 

But if you pay attention, if you know how to combine, and then it's more important how to combine than to have too many colors. It's like clothes, it's like everything in life. So now we have all the options. We have millions of colors to deal with, so... Someone... Yes? 

Audience 9: Did you say something about the website for handheld devices? Is that true or...?

Martha Gabriel: Yeah. We have handheld devices that are like computer. They have no restrictions on color, just on size. But we still have devices where the screen has eight-color depth. In these cases, if you don't pay attention, you design for one device and it's much more spread variety than just be seen in [42:28 XX], you have it. So you would need to test in all of them. So if you stick to the safe, we have [42:34 XX] the pallet, so...

Here. These are the safe colors that you have. You can see, the most important thing here is we don't have much earth colors, tertiary colors. But we still have some. We can do good combinations on that.

If you stick for that, you have much more chances of being seen in any handheld and any devices. So if you can create something with these colors, do that. The VisiBone lab, I gave you the URL, it shows exactly these colors, and you can combine them and see how they look. So try to do that. If you can't, OK. Go to other colors. But if you can, why not? You are going to be safe and everybody's going to see properly your design. This is what we want.

So I can put this in the presentation. I have taken because we wouldn't have time. But I can put the link again to the Web-Safe Colors so you can see here. I have all the links for you, OK? And all the discussion about that. And the statistics, you are very welcome.

Any more questions?

So I think it's--thank you very much for your attention. If you need any other information, I'd be happy and glad to talk to you, OK? Thank you.

[Applause]

Announcer: For more presentations from the 2008 HighEdWeb Conference visit HighEdWeb.org/2008 or sign up for our podcast and feed at HighEdWeb.org/podcast.xml

[End of Music]